394: Choosing Real Immunity

Dr. Cilla Whatcott And Ashley James


  • Dr. Cilla's documentaries
  • Homeoprophylaxis is 90% effective in terms of disease prevention
  • Hope4Cancer Center (Mexico, Tijuana, Cancun, Thailand, and Colombia)
  • Role of mental attitude and meditation
  • The support of those around you and your mental attitude are two huge factors
  • Importance of clean living
  • Fasting, the unsung hero of healing
  • Homeopathics theory – it's all about susceptibility
  • It has to be our decision what we're going to do with our body
  • Homeopathy for cancer
  • The Truth About Cancer documentary
  • Influenzinum vs. flu shot
  • The Type C personality
  • Indiscriminate inflammation is what causes autoimmunity

In this episode, Dr. Cilla Whatcott will share with us how homeoprophylaxis aids in disease prevention, the choices that we make based on our needs, two huge factors that affect our health,and what it means to have real immunity.

[00:00:00] Intro: Hello, true health seekers. And welcome to another exciting Episode the Learn True Health podcast.

I'm so excited for you to hear today's interview with Dr. Dr. Cilla Whatcott. She is a regular guest on our show. She has been in Episode 137, 155, 228, and 305. So this is her fifth time being on the show. I highly recommend you go back and listen to our past interviews, especially the first one, 137, where she shares her story.

So we jump right in to the interview without going into her story. But just a little bit of background, she's a PhD in Homeopathy, specializing in homeoprophylaxis. She shares with us some amazing information about her battle and her winning her battle with triple positive, a very aggressive form of breast cancer.

And her documentary series which is coming out in December and you can watch it for free, all three movies, that she has produced. Tons of amazing information from experts around the world who are wonderful doctors that help people to gain healthy immunity. So whether you have a chronic illness, whether you're battling cancer, whether you're a parent and you're wondering how you can support your children in fighting infections, whether you have an autoimmune condition, this Episode applies to you. Basically, if you breathe and you have a pulse, this Episode applies to you because we all want to avoid getting influenza. We all want to avoid catching colds, or having a diagnosis of some kind of worse infection, or cancer. And today we cover some amazing information about supporting the body's ability to heal itself and boosting the immune system with holistic medicine. 

Please stay tuned. I'm launching a membership site that's affordable to everyone. And it teaches people how to cook a whole food plant based diet. But what that means is you will learn amazing recipes in the kitchen that tastes phenomenal. And the focus is on healing food. So super foods and healing foods to heal the gut, to heal your liver, to heal your immune system. People who choose to still eat meat, you can still eat meat. You're just going to learn how to add more wonderful nutrient dense foods to your life. If you want to try going totally whole food plant based, we teach you how to do that too. And we teach you how to do it for busy families, for people on a budget, for people with no time, for people who don't even know how to cook. You're going to learn everything you need to learn to be an amazing cook in the kitchen cooking healing foods that are delicious for the whole family. Even kids love these recipes. I know because I have a four year old. And my partner, Naomi, has three boys who are all very picky. And we both have husbands who also have different palates. So we're having to constantly cook for many different palates. And so we bring our experience. And we do have some guest contributors as well. So we all bring our experience of how to cook on a budget, how to cook quickly, teach people how to cook with little experience. Wherever you are in the spectrum, we will help you to eat healthier and cook these delicious meals to heal the body. That's the goal.

How can we make it so that food tastes absolutely phenomenal, and is healing your body, and saves you money and saves you time? That's exactly what you're going to get from the Learn True Health Home Kitchen membership. We're launching it soon. So stay tuned. Join the Facebook Group, Learn True Health in Facebook. Or go to the website learntruehealth.com and jump on the email list to stay tuned because it's coming out soon. Awesome.

Thank you so much for being a listener. And thank you for sharing these Episodes with your friends and family so we can help as many people as possible to learn true health.

Welcome to the Learn True Health podcast. I'm your host, Ashley James. This is Episode 394.

I am so excited for today's guest. We have back on the show with us PhD Dr. Cilla Whatcott. This is your fifth time here. You're like a regular.

Photo by National Cancer Institute on Unsplash

[00:04:38] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: That's right. That's right. It's great. Thank you for having me.

[00:04:42] Ashley James: Absolutely. It's such a pleasure. I've enjoyed every interview with you. Listeners can go back and check out all of our different interviews around immunity, homeoprophylaxis, and using homeopathy, Episode 137, 155, 228, and 305.

Now, I feel like I've been with you for the last three years along your journey wanting to spread this information about immunity, and what is immunity, and building real immunity. You decided that you were going to get this information out there. Your own public service to the world. Interviewing experts on building immunity. And you've created a three part docuseries. Is it like three separate movies?

[00:05:40] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yes. Three separate full feature documentaries. They're each an hour and a half long.

[00:05:46] Ashley James: Awesome. Awesome. And I've watched the first one because you released the first one. And we talked about that in a previous interview. But now, finally, the day has come we've been waiting. That in December, you're launching all three movies about building real immunity to the public for free. And you're here today to teach us a bit about that. And share some of the details from your three movies that you've made about building real immunity. And do some myth busting, like fevers and vaccinations and whether, you know, our babies or children are immune, and how do we support their immunity. And if you've been exposed to something, does that mean you're immune. And so you'll go through some of the most common FAQs when it comes to what immunity is.

And I know you've also been on a personal health journey with cancer. And I'm very interested for you to share your story. Because I know it's an inspiring one. And you'll also give us some great information, some great tools. Because when we don't have a choice, it's a dilemma. It's a dilemma when the only thing we have is one system of medicine. And I love it when guests come on the show and share, “Hey, you may not know but there's this other system of medicine and there's actually hundreds of other systems of medicine that may help you.” And so I love to hear your story.

Tell us about these movies that you're doing. Dr. Cilla Whatcott's website is realimmunity.org. Listeners can go there to sign up to receive the emails and the access to watch the three movies that you've created, these three documentaries. So tell us about these documentaries that are going to be released in December.

[00:07:47] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yes. So the first one is Quest For Real Immunity. And it's the very first film in the series. And it's basically dispelling the fear about childhood illnesses, fever, viruses. And taking a deeper look into intuition, a mother's intuition and how that is responsible for so much of our survival, basically. So we'll look at fear, we'll look at intuition in that first film. And hear from a lot of experts, pediatricians, immunologists, researchers. Andy Wakefield is in the first film. Paul Thomas, the well-known pediatrician on the west coast is in the first film. He's a wonderful guy. And in the first film, it's fascinating because we've gone into his childhood. His history when I asked him what's made you the person that you are. So we take a look back into his upbringing in Africa. And that will be the first weekend in December, the 6th through the 8th. Forty-eight hours of free launch. And you just have to sign up through realimmunity.org or the Facebook page, Real Immunity.

And then the second weekend, we'll be launching Passage To Real Immunity. And that film takes a look at the 200 year old method of homeoprophylaxis. And this has been around for all that time. Very, very safe. About 90% effective in terms of disease prevention. And it's utilized in India, Cuba, South America. And there's a lot of families now using it in the US for childhood diseases. There was a 15 year study that supports it with children from Australia. And we'll hear also from Dr. Wakefield in that film. And a number of parents who have utilized homeoprophylaxis and what their impressions are. As well as some doctors from India, some doctors from Europe, and a researcher from Australia, Dr. Isaac Golden speaks in that film.

And then the third weekend is December, I think, it's the 20th of the 22nd, Friday through Sunday, 48 hours. And it's called Choosing Real Immunity. And this film took a turn in content when my own diagnosis came in January of this year, 2019. The universe has a way of taking us to task when we say things. Right, Ashley?

[00:10:30] Ashley James: Yeah. You've been preaching immunity and holistic medicine. Then in January you get a cancer diagnosis.

[00:10:37] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Time to walk the talk.

[00:10:39] Ashley James: Yeah. Walking the talk. Now you were probably left in that little – that point of bifurcation where you could have gone into fear mode and run to the Allopathic doctors for chemotherapy and radiation surgery. And looking at their statistics on survival, they think if you live for five years after a cancer diagnosis, that's success. And that you die at the end of five years.

In talking with an Oncologist who I interviewed with one of my friends who has cancer, she said, “You know, I recommend X, Y, Z chemotherapy.” And I asked her what are the side effects. Potential side effect being leukemia. And she says it's very small. It's a very small percentage. And it turned out that it was like 2%. And I'm like, “You know, that's not actually small.” If you think about how many people get this kind of chemotherapy, it's not that small. It's actually kind of like a large percentage of – it's thousands of people end up getting leukemia if you think how many people are getting on this kind of chemotherapy. And I don't know, I don't want to put something in my body that has a 2% chance of causing leukemia. So that's where my mind goes. So you had this moment. I definitely want to hear about it. I definitely hear about that moment where you had to walk your talk.

[00:12:24] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. So it interweaves with the content of this third film, Choosing Real Immunity, because I had to choose. I completely trashed all the content that I had lined up and ready for post-production, re-interviewed a number of different individuals, which I'll share with you. And the entire movie switched to kind of my journey in a way inadvertently. It wasn't about me. I wasn't the star of the third film. But it's about how do we choose real immunity and what are our choices.

And initially, I was struck with fear. But at the same time, Ashley, I had this intense sense that it was a sacred blessing what I was being served up. Because it was an opportunity for me to make necessary changes in my life, an opportunity for me to walk the talk that I've been teaching and preaching for the last decade, and a learning opportunity. You know, one of the things that I regretted when I got so busy in my practice was I wasn't open to learning as much because I was so busy treating and serving other people.

And one thing I had to do was cut my practice back about 70%. And I made the choice to go to Mexico, to a place called Hope4Cancer. And they have clinics in Tijuana, Cancun, Thailand, and Colombia. I went to Cancun. It's a three week program. You stay in a hotel. A van picks you up with the other patients at 7:00 a.m. You're in the clinic until 3:00 p.m. They serve your meals, all organic, natural, they juice, they cook vegetarian. There's a chef there. And then you go back to the hotel at 3:00 p.m. Have dinner with your spouse or whoever came with you. And then go back to the clinic the next morning. Six days a week. Sundays were free. And I was there for three weeks. My program includes two follow up visits, which one I took in June and when I took an October just recently. And then it includes home care for one year after that.  Where you get a phone call every three weeks but you have access to them to call them up or email them at any time to ask questions and receive home care. And they do send you home with lots of supplements, therapies, some equipment, everything comes home with you. So it's a very inclusive program. It's not a one size fits all. It's very individualized to the person and their form of cancer.

My breast cancer was stage two, but it was an aggressive form. It had a 40% proliferation rate. And it was triple positive.  And that means estrogen positive, progesterone positive, and HER2 positive. So after about eight, nine months, nothing had grown, nothing had changed, which is a win. That's a success in itself with the type of cancer that I had. But it wasn't enough for me. I wanted to see it going away. And of course, fear is always in the background when you have that kind of diagnosis. And I actually opted to have surgery at that point. So my integrative Oncologist I was seeing, Nasha Winters. And also I was having dark field microscopy, which is looking at the blood under a microscope to see at the cellular level what's happening. And both my labs and my dark field microscopy were stable and improving. So clearly I was improving at a cellular level. And everyone agreed that having surgery at that point would not be disruptive. It would not cause the cancer to spread. So I did opt to have a mastectomy at that point and remove the tumor itself. Because every time I felt it, I knew it was there. my focus was on it. And if I learned anything during this journey, it's that what we focus on enlarges. And we give it energy. Whatever we focus on, we give energy.

So roundabout June, after my initial three weeks at Hope4Cancer, I recognized what a large role my mental attitude had in the whole process, my thought processes And I decided to do a week long intensive seminar with Dr. Joe Dispenza in meditation. And it was intense. Some days we meditated as much as seven hours in a day. And they were all guided meditations that he did with lots of explanations and data about brain waves, about pineal gland, about all of the aspects that he was promoting with his education about meditation. And it was life changing. And learning how to focus one's mind and keep it focused in the right direction. And how you can change outcomes with visualization, with focus became very, very important to me. So I've been meditating 45 minutes a day ever since June when I went to that conference – that seminar.

And also interviewed Dr. Joe Dispenza, who is in the third film, Choosing Real Immunity. In the film itself, I chose to interview different individuals, Dr. Tony Jimenez, who's the medical director of Hope4Cancer, about how he chose this path. He's an MD but how did he choose this path to take? And how do people make the choice to do something alternative? I interviewed Dr. Joe Dispenza, about children's minds, and how they form, and what's happening in brainwaves in children, and how we can choose to raise our children in order to be aware and be conscious and raise their level of consciousness. I interview another gentleman who talks about the levels of consciousness themselves based on Dr. David Hawkins work. And how we can raise those levels. I interviewed Torako Yui, who's a Japanese homeopath. She was in corporate industry and was very, very sick, almost died. And met a homeopath who saved her life, turned her around, and she chose to become a homeopath and start a homeopathic school. So I've also interviewed a medical doctor who has become a homeopath. Another woman who started homeopathic school. Just lots of interviews about people making choices. Why do people choose the other road, you know, the road less traveled? And how do we do that?

Because, Ashley, my biggest goal is to inspire people to know they have choices. And they can make their life what they want it to be. And to rise above the herd, basically, and make choices for yourself based on what your needs are is really what it's all about. So Choosing Real Immunity focuses on those concepts and they spring out of my own experience.

[00:19:57] Ashley James: I'm so excited. That sounds so cool. So that's the third weekend of December?

[00:20:05] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: That's right. I think it's the 20th to the 22nd, Friday to Sunday.

[00:20:09] Ashley James: Very cool. So when you started the meditation, was that before you got the surgery?

[00:20:19] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yes. Yes. It was in June that I did the seminar.

[00:20:23] Ashley James: Did you notice – so you'd gone from never meditating to meditating 45 minutes a day every day?

00:20:30] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Pretty much. Yeah.

[00:20:32 Ashley James: Did you notice a difference? Because you were focusing on your health so intensely at that time, was there a shift in your health after incorporating meditation?

[00:20:47] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Initially, it was very difficult to meditate. Because I always considered myself someone who couldn't. That my mind was so busy. And then initially when I started meditating, a lot of disruption came up. And a lot of depression, tears, angst, anxiety came up. And it wasn't until I went to the seminar and really got a better handle on what the goals were and lowered my expectations of myself that I could meditate more effectively and just relax into it. And the biggest impact was on anxiety and clarity. Because the anxiety is always there. When you get a diagnosis like this – I'm sorry – fear becomes your bedfellow. And you wake up in the middle of the night with thoughts. So it's inevitable. And it's not like you ever step off the path because there's always that question of whether you're doing everything you can so that it doesn't come back. So it's really your mind you have to control. Because I'm a huge observer of human nature and read and read and read voraciously about people's cancer stories and their experiences. And what's the difference between someone who goes into complete remission and someone who doesn't. And meeting people at the Hope4Cancer Center and my own clients who chose one way or another way. So I became very curious about what contributes to that. And I have to say that support of those around you and your mental attitude are two huge factors. Huge. So I needed to get a handle on that. I'm a fretter by nature. And I just had to get a handle on that in meditation.

Photo by Ben White on Unsplash

[00:22:45] Ashley James: And when we're in anxiety, we're triggering the stress response and we are decreasing our body's ability to actually get into healing mode. Because we're in the sympathetic response instead of the parasympathetic response. So when you start to meditate and get good at it, and start to relax into it, you're putting yourself into healing mode. After maybe a few weeks after you started to get more practice and more proficient at meditation and you realized that you were in the healing mode of the autonomic nervous system's parasympathetic response of rest and digest, did you see any changes to labs or to markers? Did you see, “Because I added meditation daily, I can see this X, Y, Z.” Like you can see it as a result, was there anything specific that you could point to and say, “I believe this is because I added meditation.”

[00:23:51] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Well, my labs have consistently improved over the span of time. But I've been doing many, many things. So it's hard to fair it out exactly what the introduction of meditation did because I've been doing multiple things at the same time. So lots of supplementation, coffee enemas, ultrasound to the tumor, infrared light, GcMAF injections, IV vitamin C, UVBI, which is Ultraviolet Blood Irradiation, all of these – hyperbaric chamber, hyperthermia, whole body hyperthermia. I would get my internal temperature up to 108 degrees Fahrenheit. So all of these things were being done concurrently with the meditation. So it's hard to say which one was doing the most. And honestly, I tried to apply my intuition. Because some things I would eliminate or reduce. And it was a matter of just getting quiet and asking myself, is this really important for me right now? Or can I cut back on it? Do I need to replace it with something? And that's kind of how I've worked.

And I will say, Ashley, to that, I think the hardest part for most people is it's very comforting to have somebody drive the bus. And somebody to say, “This is what you need to do. This is going to work. You must do this.” And there's a relinquishment of your personal agency in that. And it's like they're going to fix me. And I could never do that. I would love to be able to but I couldn't do that. So I have reached out to colleagues. I've reached out to my integrative Oncologist. I see her once every three months by phone. I reached out to the Hope4Cancer doctors. But then I have to take all that information and crunch it up and decide what I'm going to choose. And I've had to make the final decision, which for some people I understand is daunting. It's very challenging to do that.

And that's what I saw in my practice. Like I've had different clients in my practice with cancers, different breast cancer or other cancers, who have chosen one way or the other way. And I've watched because those who choose the conventional way, it's mostly because their families pressured them. So that's the support system. And their doctors convinced them it was the only way to survive. So it's the mental piece and it's the support piece. And if you have family, loved ones, around you saying, “You have to do this. We want you to do this.” It's very difficult to resist that. As opposed to having people around you who support what you choose.

[00:26:50] Ashley James: So you chose to not do chemo and not do radiation. And you spent eight months doing holistic treatments. And you stopped the growth of the tumor in its tracks, which is very hard to do because of how aggressive it is. It did not spread because everything that you were doing, all the natural medicine you were doing. And then you had decided after eight months of being you're in a good spot, all your labs are showing that you're in excellent health, everything's improving, you decided, “Let's just get it out.” And you got clean margins. It's been removed. How many months has it been since the surgery?

[00:27:34] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Early September, I had the surgery. So it's just been two months.

[00:27:38] Ashley James: And what is considered – like, at what point will you go, “Okay. That was a success.” At what point do you say, “I'm done.” Obviously you're cancer free and all your scans are clear. But do you wait a few years? Are you able to just go live your life now?

[00:28:03] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Honestly, it's a little hard to just live your life because you're always living in the specter of that diagnosis to a certain degree. Let me digress for just a minute, cancer produces stem cells. And it's a known fact that chemo radiation, those therapies don't kill stem cells. So that's why you can kill the original tumor. And then two years later or three years later, you've got it cropping up in another organ because the stem cells went out and proliferated somewhere else. So the only way to address stem cells is at a cellular level with your real immunity. You boost your real immunity and it can mitigate the spread of those stem cells. So that's my insurance. And I will always be kind of on my case about maybe my diet, maintain my supplements, getting exercise, getting strength training, make sure I'm not working too much, all of the factors.

Hope4Cancer talks about seven principles of healing. And to apply those seven principles always for prevention. So that's going to be my insurance going forward to always be applying those principles.

[00:29:23] Ashley James: Are those principles taught in your last documentary, the Choosing Real Immunity?

[00:29:33] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: I don't elucidate the seven principles. I talked with Dr. Tony and he has a recent book out which he shows in the film. And the book does go through the seven principles.

[00:29:45] Ashley James: Okay. So it's like a whole book?

[00:29:48] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a whole book. Right. Right. It's a lot easier and more straightforward than one would think. It's clean living. It's your diet, your exercise, your thoughts, your support system, your environmental toxins. I mean, all of these things are what contribute. You want to reduce the toxins, you want to increase the support, you want to increase nutrition, you want to get rid of baggage. So you look at your past. You forgive who you have to forgive. You move on. All of those aspects really clean your system so that you can move forward in a more healthy way.

[00:30:36] Ashley James: You mentioned diet, What is your diet right now? What is the beat and prevent cancer diet that you prescribed to?

[00:30:44] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: There are a lot of differing opinions on this. She laughs. Yeah.

[00:30:50] Ashley James: That's why I'm asking. Because I'm like, “I'm very curious.” There's so many diets out there for killing cancer.

[00:30:57] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: So many opinions. Yes. At the Hope4Cancer clinic, it was all vegetarian. Organic, of course. A lot of juicing. And that was good. That was great. They do a nutritional consult with you. But I've also, with Nasha Winters, my integrative Oncologist, she's looked at my genetic snips. And she has said to me, “You must eat meat. That you're genetically not wired to only eat vegetarian.” So I add chicken and some beef and fish. I stay away from grains. I stay away from gluten. I stay away from sugar. So those three things. And I try to do intermittent fasting. So intermittent fasting has been – I can feel it in my body making improvements. So I'll fast for anywhere from 13 to 18 hours a day during the week. And then the goal is to do a 24 hour fast at least once a month. In the beginning, I did a four day fast. And it was difficult. And I can feel the difference in my level of strength. I am much stronger now. I have much more energy now. And that's a little bit of my barometer for whether I'm on the right diet and going in the right direction.

[00:32:26] Ashley James: Yes. I've had some interviews, really interesting interviews on fasting. And one man, Troy Reicherter, he's done $20,000 with the labs. He does one big fast a year. And he's been doing all these labs to determine how much pollution is in his body. And whether fasting works. And what he's seeing is that fasting has a lasting effect. It's not something like you do your four day fast and then two weeks later, it's not affecting you. It's like, it is still affecting you even months later. And he shows that even a year after a 21 day fast. His health benefits are there.

And I've had other people like Robyn Openshaw shared this that they're finding that fasting has lasting health effects or very long term health effects. And also Episode 230 with Dr. Alen Goldhamer, who runs the TrueNorth Medical Center. And he does water only medically supervised fasting. He had a woman come in -he published this actually. He had a woman come in with end stage cancer. The Oncologist told her to go home and die. And 30 days after her fast, she was completely cancer free. And all the scans showed it. So he published that and he talks about it in the interview. So the fasting is such a powerful tool. I'm curious why you don't do long fasts.

[00:34:07] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: I need to get back on it. I just been distracted. I've been doing so much traveling back and forth to Mexico. And it's been life. It's gotten in the way. But I should. You're inspiring me to do another long fast. And actually my integrative Oncologist, Nasha Winters, that's how she started her career. She was 19, diagnosed with ovarian cancer end stage. They told her to go home and die. They couldn't do chemo. They couldn't do anything. And she fasted for a month. And this is 20 years ago.

[00:34:37] Ashley James: Oh my, I got to interview her too. Wow.

[00:34:41] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. She's a great interview.

[00:34:43] Ashley James: Cool. Go to the TrueNorth Medical Center. They just take care of you. It's like going on vacation and then you fast there. So I find it challenging to fast in my house. There's a kitchen here and I have to feed people. I mean, it's doable. I've done it. But the TrueNorth Medical Center is in California and it's very pretty. And I've talked to many people who've gone there. And I'm planning on going there. I've just got to save up the time and money to do it. But I'm absolutely – it's on my life bucket list to go spend, like, a month there. It's quite affordable. It's a nonprofit, which is wonderful. And if I win the lottery, I'd definitely donate to him. And it's now sort of become a teaching clinic. So there's all kinds – and these aren't, like, new doctors, like, residents. These are doctors that have been doctors for many years and they want to then learn this system. So there's a ton of, basically, doctor students that are there. But they've all have great amount of experience. And they come and learn from Dr. Goldhamer.

And so it's about the cost of a good hotel. So it's something like $170 a night kind of thing. And it includes a very nice bed in your room. And your meals when you're not fasting or you're re-feeding and all that. And then they have classes and socialization. So you're never bored. And lots of fun things to do. And you're doing a lot of resting also. And then you have doctor visits basically in the morning and in the evening. And all the medical staff are there in case anything happens. But I've talked to several people and I've heard that it's an amazing place to go.

But I love that you brought up fasting because I think it's this an unsung hero of healing, right? Because I think when we – it's free. Essentially, you could do a short fast at home. Like, a three day fast doesn't require medical supervision. Anything after three days, it's better to be medically supervised is what Dr. Goldhamer says. Or if you're doing like you'd you do, 18 hour fasts, you can still go to work. You can still even maybe do light exercise like walking. It's not that disruptive. But when we get into longer than three day fasts, that's when we really should take the steps to be monitored.

So I like that you bring this up, because I think that when things are free, we don't really value them. Like doing a hot shower and then a cold shower and then a hot shower. The things that we could do that every day. Or we can go for a walk or we can do meditation, these are free things. And I think it's part of our mentality is to is to not think that they're that great because they're free. But when I hear that it's made a ton of difference for you and even helped your Oncologist to heal her own cancer 20 years ago, that's so cool. I love hearing that.

It's interesting because I thought that your docu series was sort of going this route of vaccines versus natural medicine. And I know you're not overtly saying this isn't my antivaxxer movement. You're not going that route. But I kind of got the feeling that it was more about immunity. Like, don't get the flu shot, go do things to just be healthy and boost your immune system, for example. And you bring up cancer, obviously, because it's in your experience. But it made me think, “You know, I think we think cancer is so different.” It's so different from catching something like the flu or polio. But it's the immune system, right? Is cancer a failure – is getting cancer a failure of the immune system?

[00:39:05] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: You bring up a very good point. And first, I want to address your comment that, yes, initially, it was all about using homeoprophylaxis as a safe method as opposed to vaccination. And early on, I realized I couldn't jump in that pool too quickly. First, I had to lay down a foundation of what is immunity and what are the experts saying. So the first film came out as kind of laying the groundwork. The second film was about homeoprophylaxis, saying, “Look, here is an option. It's viable. It's safe. It's effective.” The third film was going to then wrap things up and summarize everything. And that got waylaid into down a new path.

And to answer your question, the realization is it doesn't matter if it's a cold or if it's cancer. It's all about our immune system. It's about what is self and not self, basically. And the conventional thinking about cancer is that it's this foreign invader that you have to kill or fight. And no, it's you. It's you gone awry. It's your immune system that's not functioning properly. And all you have to do is reteach it how to function properly and it will take care of the situation. So it's really truly right in line with everything else about real immunity. And that's the big misconception about cancer. And the way it's been treated conventionally with chemo, radiation, chemo, radiation. Insurance will pay for. That's all Oncologist can recommend. It's just this mantra in the conventional field when the Reality is, every person's cancer needs to be treated differently.

And I've watched how individualized care has been applied to each person that goes through Hope4Cancer. Because I've formed this relationships with other people, patients there, and watched how if they're not moving forward, they introduced some other methods. And they just keep applying different methods because just like the immune system has intelligence, that aberration of the immune system will keep trying to find a workaround. And you have to address it in a way that it hears – listens so that your system can then move in the direction of health. So not everybody's treatment is the same that Hope4Cancer. We start out the same with certain nutritional IVs and coffee enemas, et cetera. But then it becomes much more highly individualized as time goes on.

[00:42:00] Ashley James: So you said that Oncologists are only allowed to legally recommend radiation, chemo, and surgery. And I've heard this many times before. And I think that when the law doesn't let a doctor let you know about other treatments that are proven to help, then it's like, “Who is the law protecting? Is it protecting the drug cartel? The big pharma?” Who is it really protecting? Oncologists are highly intelligent that they've spent a decade studying. And you go to one and they've probably been working for like 15 years in the field. They're very intelligent. They're really good at reading studies. Why are they given the freedom to also look at alternative methods and go, “Well, we've seen – this group over here has seen improvements when they eat this way and use this herb and do this sauna therapy.” It's just, really? We're not allowed to say that that is good. Now, how is it that your Oncologist is practicing and recommending alternative medicine?

[00:43:31] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Well, she's a Naturopath, first and foremost. She's not an MD. She's a Naturopath. But I'll answer your question, Ashley, with a question back to you. And that is, if you went to medical school. And you had to have $200,000 in school debt. And you were indoctrinated into this program where you were taught that anything alternative is baloney. And that the conventional way is the only way. And then you sold chemo drugs that you then upsell to your patients and make an additional revenue. How easily could you admit that there's another way?

[00:44:11] Ashley James: I like that you brought that up because when I heard that, that was the nail in the coffin for me. That when an MD prescribes every round of chemotherapy – every dose of chemotherapy, they get a kickback. They get thousands of dollars. That's their boat payment. That's their child going to another college class like that. They're being bribed to prescribe chemotherapy.

[00:44:42] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Well, I like to see this positive reinforcement. If you got an m&m every time you did something. It's positive reinforcement. It's very difficult to do something different. But some of them are humble enough that they'll recognize maybe there's another way. I've run into too much arrogance in that field and it's difficult. It's really difficult. Because those of us who want to explore unconventional things in alternative medicine are viewed as crackpots or idiots. Anyway, that's another topic we could delve into.

[00:45:27] Ashley James: So when we develop a tumor,they say that it's been like four or eight years in development. It's not overnight. Although might feel overnight. But it's actually been a long time coming that the body went from having a few cancer cells to just so much that we're seeing it for the first time. When we grew a tumor – I mean, the body is clearing out cancer every day. Little tiny mutations the immune systems sees it and clears it out. What happens that the immune system didn't clear out yours or didn't clear out other people's cancer? Why does it? What happens has the body not recognize that that's a cancer?

[00:46:17] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Well, to some extent, it's what you said earlier about sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system. It overcomes the system. The system is not in the healing phase enough hours a day to do its work. So we're always on a trajectory. We're always by virtue of the choices we make each day, do we get enough sleep? Are we drinking water? How are we eating? We are on a trajectory. Either we're static or we're getting better or we're getting worse. So if you take enough days going down that trajectory and getting worse, it allows your body the leeway to build up those aberrant cells and proliferate those cancer cells. Because they're sending out millions of stem cells, a tumor does, daily. So those can go park in other organs. And if you're compromising your system with your diet or with stress – stress is a huge one – or with excessive toxins in your environment, then it gives your body the opportunity to proliferate those cells.

Photo by Johnny McClung on Unsplash

[00:47:27] Ashley James: And have you seen – I know you didn't do this for your own cancer,  but have you seen any therapies that turn the immune system back on to the point where the body now recognizes a tumor?

[00:47:43] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Well, some of the studies show full body hyperthermia is enormous. The main things that were used to Hope4Cancer, heat, light, sound, and oxygen. Those four things. So heat, when you raise the core temperature that engages your immune system and turns it on high alert. So there are documented cases of people getting measles and having a brain tumor disappear. Or some acute disease which then ameliorates the chronic disease. And this is documented in the literature. Because the acute is event for the deeper pathology. So by getting a fever, it charges that immune system. Now, apparently the literature shows that doing it intermittently for short bursts is effective. But much of what I've read and been familiar with are cases when it's a longer term acute illness, like measles and there's 103 fever for a week or longer period of time with a high fever. But at Hope4Cancer, we went into whole body hyperthermia where you have heat above you, heat below you. And they ramp up your internal temperature. They keep taking your internal temperature. Mine was up to 108 degrees.

[00:49:13] Ashley James: For how long?

[00:49:15] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Maybe ten minutes. And then it takes a while to come down. You just can't tolerate it much longer. And I had the freedom to get out when I needed to get out. But I would try to stay in as long as possible. But it's ramping up your immune system. The other thing is a hyperbaric chamber. So you're forcing oxygen into the cells. And cancer does not like heat, does not like light,and does not like oxygen. Those are three environmental conditions where it can't live. So we would do heat therapy. And it was just like a wand with heat on the actual tumor for five minute just on the tumor itself. Infrared lamp on the tumor. Laser lights on the tumor. They would do infrared where they take 100 milliliters of blood out. Inject that hundred milliliters with ozone, which is oxygen. Run it past ultraviolet light. And back into your body. So now you've irradiated the blood and oxygenated it and returned it to the body. That's a great therapy.

[00:50:32] Ashley James: Can you explain why ozone and ultraviolet directly to the blood, why that is a great therapy? It doesn't kill the white blood cells or red blood cells.

[00:50:44] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: No. But it kills all the parasitic infections, viruses, the comorbidities of cancer. Typically people with cancer have comorbidities. They have lyme. They have Epstein Barr. They have parasites. And the question is, did those things open them up to be more susceptible to cancer? Or did the cancer compromise their immune system in such a way as to take on those other afflictions? But regardless, the UVBI can help to address some of those comorbidities, which that's essential in treating cancer. So I forget your original question.

[00:51:30] Ashley James: I was just –

[00:51:31] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Specific therapies you were saying.

[00:51:32] Ashley James: Yeah. No. We're on a tangent and I like the tangent. And that's okay. I interviewed Dr. Tullio Simoncini, who is an Oncologist in Italy. And he, I believe had his license taken away for curing cancer. How dare he? how dare have the audacity to cure cancer naturally? But what he saw when he cut open tumors is that they would look like yeast. The inside of a tumor looks like yeast. And he thought, “This is so weird.” And he had someone – and I apologize for not remembering all the details of the story. But listeners can go listen to the Episode because it's fascinating. It's Episode 136. And he had a patient who was sort of on their deathbed and it's kind of like last ditch effort. So he took sodium bicarbonate which he says it kills Candida, it kills yeast. And he took a solution and injected it into the — no. He washed their colons. It's colon cancer. He washed their colon with it. Kind of like a colonic. That was his first attempt and it worked. And then he had another person that, I believe, was a child in a coma. And it was like they have hours to live because the tumor was so big. And he took sodium bicarbonate, injected it into the vasculature right before the tumor. So it fed straight into the vasculature of the tumor. Sodium bicarbonate, if you inject it into you, the solution he had would not hurt anyone. But it would kill yeast or Candida. And then he went on break and he came back and the child was sitting up and laughing with the mom. And he just freaked out. So that's what led him down this road of treating cancer with sodium bicarbonate. But the problem is you can't just drink it or put it up your bum like he did with that one person. You have to have a surgeon, he says. Because you have to have it injected straight into the vasculature of the tumor to be effective. And he sees that he's had a very high success rate. Because my thing is like, “Well, is it all tumors or only some tumors?”

And this is interesting that you're bringing up co-infections. I've had many lyme experts on the show talk about when someone has a lyme infection so they have Lyme disease, they always have other parasites. It's like at least three. We start to see that it's a Catch 22, what came first? Did the person have co-infections? Did the person have these parasites and have these multiple infections sort of hanging around the body because the environment of the body was a perfect storm, a perfect petri dish –

[00:54:36] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Environment, yeah.

[00:54:36] Ashley James: – for these infections? And then Lyme came around and their body was amazing petri dish for the lyme to propagate. Whereas, other people might have been bit by that same tick and the body clears out the lyme.

[00:54:51] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Exactly. And it's all about susceptibility. That's homeopathics theory. It's about our susceptibility. We could all be in the room with someone with Ebola or measles, some will catch it, some won't. It's about your susceptibility. And that's the terrain.

[00:55:05] Ashley James: I had Dr. Heather Wolfson on the show. I've had both Wolfson's.  The husband who's the cardiologist and the wife who's a chiropractor. And she's even more than a chiropractor, which many chiropractors are because they know so much about nutrition and healing. And she said, if you had 100 people in a room with polio, 95% of them would be asymptomatic. And that blew my mind. Because I was raised to believe that polio is incredibly dangerous, deadly. It's like Ebola. Everyone's going to get it. But no, it's not the case. I mean, obviously, it's not like, “Oh, yeah. Let's all have a polio party.” It's not what I'm saying. But it's just looking at when you have really healthy people and you really have a cleansed body and the body is not a good petri dish, it's not a good environment, it's alkaline, it's balanced, you're in a parasympathetic state as much as possible, it's not a good environment to host illness.

And so it's interesting that I've never heard someone bring this up that you say that when we look at people with cancer, even before they had the cancer, they can see that they actually had other infections going on. They had Candida or Lyme disease or parasites but they their body was already a petri dish building up illness.

[00:56:42] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Right. Right. But these days who doesn't have all of those infections? I mean, seriously. You know what I mean? The world is a crazy place and people are sick. Because of our environmental toxicity, we're just bombarded.

[00:57:01] Ashley James: It's the rare person who is of optimal health. But we all strive for it. So that's why we're here. We want to learn for you. How long were you vegetarian during your cancer therapies?

[00:57:17] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Probably from when I first was diagnosed in January until the end of March, April, May, somewhere there.

[00:57:28] Ashley James: Okay. So like, maybe, four months. And then your Naturopathic Oncologist told you to add meat back. Did you notice that you felt better after adding meat?

[00:57:37] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Oh, yeah. I feel I had much more strength, much more vitality.

[00:57:42] Ashley James: I really I really liked that she looked at your genetic markers for this. We have a Facebook Group, Learn True Health Facebook Group, there's 3,300 listeners in it. And I love the wonderful discussions. And she's been a listener for a year. She's passionate about it. Loves the show. And she's probably listening right now. So hello. But she said that she was concerned that I was leaning towards sort of anti-meat. And I feel like in every Episode, we talked about diet, I say – I feel like I'm just a parrot saying the same thing. I don't believe in diet dogma. You have to figure out what your body needs right now.

Cilla, you might find in a year from now you need to go vegan or raw vegan. And then next year, you might find the right to go carnivore. But you have an open mind and a willingness and you're not buying into any dogma. You're looking at your labs. And you're looking at your genetics. You're looking at your own body's ability and how you're feeling. And I think that when some people get – for example, they go keto. And they're eating. And it might be unhealthy keto. Maybe they're eating bacon and avocados and cheese all day. And they lose some weight and then they buy into the dogma of it. And then they are upset and unwilling to look at anything that opposes keto. And that's a problem, when we buy into any diet and are unwilling to look at the rest of the information out there. Because our body is constantly changing and its needs are changing.

Me, I have done well over 30 diets to heal my body. And I'm willing to make these changes. And what I have found working for me this last year on my blood work – I get my blood work done every four months. And I have never been healthier. I almost cry every time I go to the Naturopathic office and get my blood results and have my next follow up and get my blood taken again. Because I'm on the best path for me and it's because I'm on a whole food plant based, no oil and no salt and sugar diet. And that's my health. My path. I'm not imposing that on you or on anyone. But I'm passionate to share what's working for me. And I'm happy that I'm on this path. And I love that you're sharing that. It sounds like you're doing a more paleo style eating. No greens, you're eating, obviously organic free range, and you're focusing on a ton of vegetables. And that is working best for your health. So I honor that. And I'm really glad that you got to share that.

[01:00:20] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Thank you. Yeah. It's tricky. I think it's been the most challenging part of the healing journey because I wanted somebody to tell me something was the right way to go. And I have to figure it out myself and that's hard.

[01:00:37] Ashley James: I love that you brought that up. It's hard. We just want to hand over our choices to an expert. We want to feel like a child again and have a mother take care of us. But we're adults. And especially if we have a health issue, we need to take the reins. And it's okay to lean on our doctor experts that we put on our team. That we get to hire our Naturopath or our Oncologist or whoever we have on our team and bounce things off of them. But ultimately, it has to be our decision what we're going to do with our body. That level of advocacy will allow us to listen to our intuition and steer the ship in the right direction. Do you have any resources? Obviously, people need to go to your website realimmunity.org and they need to watch these documentaries. Do you have any resources that you highly recommend listeners check out for –

[1:01:46] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Definitely the Hope4Cancer clinics. Their website is hope and then the number four cancer.com. And they have some excellent – they have a third party researcher doing their stats on survival rates. And I was just speaking with the director in October and they were amazed when their stats came in and asked them to recheck them because they couldn't believe it. Conventional medicine for stage four cancers, lung and pancreatic, the survival rate after four years is 2 to 3% for stage four of those types of cancers. Hope4Cancer, the survival rate after four years, stage four pancreatic and lung 44%.

[01:02:36] Ashley James: I would love to see like a third one, which is people who choose to not – they get the diagnosis and they're like, “I don't want chemo radiation. I'm just going to go on a road trip and see what happens.”

[01:02:54] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Right. go live my life.

[01:02:57] Ashley James: Go live my life and see what happens. I mean, obviously, you know, there's people out there that do that. And it'd be cool if we could see the statistics on no treatments and just living life. Maybe how the treatment is, like, being happier versus cut, burn, and poison versus intense holistic therapies. I'm guessing the bill for the Hope4Cancer Center is like in the tens of thousands.

[01:03:28] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: The cost? Yeahh. So I think it's different depending on which therapies they're recommending for you. Mine was $50,000. It includes the three weeks there, including food and hotel, and all my treatments. It includes everything going home for three months of a home care program, supplements, equipment, injections. And then it includes two follow ups coming back and a year of home support.

[01:04:00] Ashley James: I mean, I know that's a lot of money. But it also sounds kind of reasonable when you think about –

[01:04:07] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: I know. Well, here's a comparison. I had a needle biopsy done in the beginning. Which I struggled with because I didn't really want to interrupt the tumor but I wanted proof of exactly what kind of tumor I had. And our deductible hadn't been satisfied yet. So we had a large deductible. That biopsy cost me $10,000. A needle biopsy. I'm still paying $500 a month for it.

[01:04:38] Ashley James: Oh my gosh.

[01:04:39] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. That's the condition of conventional medicine. It's shameful.

[01:04:47] Ashley James: So where does homeopathy play a role when someone has a cancer diagnosis? Obviously, you're a homeopath. You love homeopathy. Because there's no homeopathy for cancer. It's because it's not about treating the –

[01:05:07] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Oh, yeah. No. There is.

[01:05:09] Ashley James: There is?

[01:05:09] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: There definitely is. And there are studies. The  Banerjee Clinic out of India has studies in coordination with MD Anderson Cancer Center.

[01:05:18] Ashley James: You're blowing my mind right now. Okay. Tell us more about this. Tell us what the study is. I want to know.

[01:05:20] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. So the main study is with a gliomas, like brain tumors. Some very significant studies. And there's a method called the Radha Krishna method. I've used it on a number of cancer patients. There is definitely homeopathic treatment for cancers. I didn't rely entirely on only homeopathy. I used the shotgun approach of probably too many therapies, you know, everything from –

[01:05:51] Ashley James: I would be right there with you. Because, to me, it doesn't matter which one works. They all work. They're all going to work because I'm going to heal this. So as long as you're okay with doing all of them, I wouldn't be upset about it like. If it's something little – like I don't know – if it was Lyme Disease and someone wanted to try one therapy at a time because maybe budget or maybe they're just scientific and they want to see one thing at a time. Lyme disease you have time. Whereas cancer, it has that sort of potential of metastasizing. And we want to address it as fast as possible. At the same time, we want to take enough time to figure out what our steps are and not be rushed into anything. So we do – I love that they teach this when watching the docu series, The Truth About Cancer. Which I've had Ty Bollinger on the show before. All the experts there on this docu series say, you have enough time to slow down, get out of fear mode, and make a plan of action. And they say if you go to an Oncologist, they're going to try to rush you into your therapy within days and not give you any breathing room to second guess. Or to even get a second opinion. And so all these experts or these Oncologists on Truth About Cancer said get a second opinion, slow down, make a plan of action. But once you have the plan of action, then then rush into it and do it. So you did the shotgun approach, which is great. But you did use some homeopathy because there are studies. Tell us about the studies in India.

[01:07:36] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Well, the Banerjee doctors are generations of doctors. They have a very large clinic in India. They see thousands of patients a day. It's an amazing clinic. It's homeopathy applied in an allopathic way because they apply it based on diagnosis. So it's a little bit different than the classical approach. There's some different schools of thought within homeopathy. But nonetheless, it's viable. It's applicable to many different conditions. And the study with MD Anderson Center was specifically on gliomas. So different brain tumors and the use of homeopathic remedies. And they saw good results.

[01:08:21] Ashley James: Do you remember what the numbers were?

[01:08:24] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: I can't recall the numbers off the top of my head. But I know they were positive.

[01:08:30] Ashley James: So much so that you remember it. That you remember that it was a worthwhile study and that it was better than chance.

[01:08:39] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Exactly. And the fact that MD Anderson would be open to doing something like that is interesting.

[01:08:45] Ashley James: Cool.

[01:08:47] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: So homeopathy is a deep curative form of system of medicine, a whole system of medicine.

[01:08:54] Ashley James: Yes. And we've talked about it before in the show and other people talk about it. I think, it might have been the last time you came on the show, you talked about what we can do instead of the flu vaccine. And I love your homeopathy for the flu, the Influenzinum. We used it in our entire family – it's been a year. We've used it for the last year. And our entire family has not gotten the flu. We were getting it – and we have a toddler and he is a germ magnet, you know, because they bring home everything.

And I know I could also contribute to the fact that I'm on a healing journey. So my body, obviously, is healthier today than it was a year ago. But I was getting the flu at least once a year. And I haven't had a flu. And the whole family. And I haven't had a flu in the last year and none of us have and we've been using your Influenzinum. So I'm very excited about that. What else do you want to make sure that we cover that we make sure that listeners know about?

[01:10:07] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Well, the films, of course, because it'll be launched free and those will be available. But also the homeoprophylaxis programs. I mean, the programs that we provide through realimmunity.org, they're based on Dr. Isaac Golden's 15 year study in Australia. So he saw a 90% effectiveness rate with this particular program. And more than just protecting from disease, it exercises the immune system and matures it in a way that supports the natural development of children. So it's an amazing program.

And my goal really, Ashley, is to change the paradigm. Not just to sell a widget or a product but to change the paradigm so people understand the power of their immunity and how supporting it is the best thing you can do. And homeoprophylaxis is an amazing way to support it. And I'm overcome with grief when I see the new normal cropping up and people accepting asthma and chronic conditions as normal. This is not how children are intended to be.

And my families that do homeoprophylaxi, they rave about how vibrant their children are. And how their speech is miles ahead. Their cognitive skills or developmental leaps, it's amazing. And this is how kids are supposed to be. So I can't say enough about the HP programs. I would urge anyone to look into it and see the value of it in terms of shifting that paradigm.

The other thing we're going to do at Real Immunity is we're starting these empowerment groups. So the goal is to support groups of parents who think like this but feel like they're alone. And media would have us think that everybody wants to vaccinate and everybody has these certain ideas. It's simply not true. And part of my goal in making the Real Immunity series was to support those parents who are thinking clearly but they think they're alone and they're afraid to speak up. So these empowerment groups, we're going to be starting them probably just in the beginning of 2020. What they are is an opportunity for people to get together and view segments of the films. They'll be divided into three segments each. And then there's discussion questions. There's mechanisms for support. It's a whole process of empowering this group so their consciousness gets raised to a certain level. And we know from one of the interviews in the third film, that people operating at a certain level of consciousness have the capacity to bring up tens of thousands of other people in their consciousness. So what we're doing is we're replacing outmoded ideas with truth and with a new paradigm of real immunity. And that's what the empowerment groups are intended to do.

[01:13:16] Ashley James: Oh, fun. Very cool. Well, you discussed homeoprophylaxis in Episode 137 in a detailed way that made me incredibly passionate about it. And I really feel that this is a tool that should be in every single parents tool belt to train the child's immune system so that it's responding in a healthy way to these infections should the child be exposed to them. And when you cited that in India, for example, they've had millions of people go through homeoprophylaxis. And they've seen success n Australia, in India, in Cuba. It blew my mind that they don't have side effects and they have incredible success. Whereas, we can't say the same for vaccines.

[01:14:17] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Right? Absolutely.

[01:14:20] Ashley James: You've talked –

[01:14:23] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: And they're so easily distributed. There's no cold chain. It's inexpensive for third world countries. It's not species specific. It's not gender orage specific. I mean, there's so many benefits to be utilized worldwide. Why not? Except it doesn't bring revenue to pharma.

[01:14:41] Ashley James: I just read, there's a Pacific Island, that – small Pacific island that had three babies – three infants instantly die after getting a vaccine recently. And it turns out that the vaccines were made incorrectly. I mean, whereas you won't find that using homeopathy. And then this is something new to me that something, like 85% of our vaccines now come from China that or manufactured in China. And I believe it was recent. It was very recent that in congressional hearings, the FDA said that they do not – China does not need to disclose the ingredients of the vaccines. I was reading this article and I was shocked.

[01:15:42] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: That's shocking. I'm not familiar with that information but I would believe it.

[01:15:48] Ashley James: Well, you bring up the quality. So I'll have to pull it up and find it. But you bring up the quality of the chain of custody and all the things that go into ensuring the safety of a vaccine vs. homeopathy. One is, with a vaccine, there's so many chances that something could go wrong. Whereas, with homeopathy, it's inert. It's energetic medicine versus molecular medicine. We've had a few people in the Facebook Group talk about not wanting to get the flu vaccine. One woman last year wrote she was very upset. She had recently had the flu vaccine and became so sick. She never been that sick in her life. She was contemplating going to the hospital. She was that sick. She says she felt like she was dying. And she was so upset at herself. Because she bought into – we have a constant bombardment, “I go to the grocery store, you can get 20% off your groceries if you get a flu shot at my local grocery store – near a grocery store near us.” Every very place I go into I feel – like even Costco, there's a big sign, “Get your vaccine. Get your vaccine.” Every time I go- not the Naturopath, of course. But other doctors offices, they're asking me several times if I want a flu shot. So we're constantly having it offered to us. And maybe we buy into the – it's easy to buy into the fear and go, “Well, we should get this because we're protecting ourselves. We're protecting others.” You know, buy into this fear. And she was really upset that she did that because she didn't want to buy into the fear. And she realized she had.

And then others have shared in the Learn True Health group that they want to choose a different way. Can you share with us – if you could just bust some myths about the flu shot. We're taught that it is protective. We're taught that it will ensure that – or at least really significantly decrease our chance of getting the flu. And for some, the flu is fatal. So that it's really smart to get the flu shot and we're really stupid if we don't get the flu shot. Can you bust some myths about the flu shot versus Influenzinum, or example, which is the homeopathy version of the flu shot.

[01:18:19] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Right. Right. So initially I'd send people to the Cochrane Collaboration. The Cochrane Collaboration is a group that's unrelated to pharma and does meta analysis. They take lots of data. They crunch it. They look at it. And they come up with analysis of that data. And what they have said is that under the age of two, flu shots are no more effective than placebo. They don't work. For the elderly, they don't prevent transmission of the flu. And they don't reduce hospital stays. And then we know for a fact, because the CDC comes out with a percentage how much they're working. I'm not familiar with what it is this year. But I think they said it was lower than it's been in many, many years. So we know it's not that effective to start with.

Then I would point people to a study by Cowling and Fang from 2012. And that study showed us that what it does, it compromises TH1, which is your innate arm of your immune system. So you may have protection about whatever particular strain has been targeted for that year. But what's happened, you've compromised your immunity to every other virus going around. So these people get sicker with other viruses. Another study that's out, and I can't quote the authors on this one. It's not on the top of my mind. But study that shows us repeated flu shots makes you more susceptible to catching the flu as well. That the efficacy wanes.

So from many different angles, we see that flu shots are not what they're trumped up to be. When I was growing up the only people that were recommended to get flu shots were those in nursing homes closed communities. But never for children. So Influenzinum is something that's made from a variety of historical flus. So flus are ancient viruses. They continue to mutate over time. They're a life form. They're going to find a way. So they mutate and change. And they reside many times in fowl, you know, birds. And then come into human hosts. And the Influenzinum is a combination of a variety of historical flus. So it covers all the mutations because homeopathy is based on treating it's symptom picture. It's not the actual species or a type of flu. So any mutation is going to be covered. It's completely safe. You don't need a new one each year, from the Influenzinum that I use. Some of them are being sold because they're selling a product so there is a new one each year. It's based on the flu vaccine basically. But mine has the historical flus. And then mine has Tubercalinum, which covers the [inaudible 01:21:30] tendency to be susceptible to lung infections. So very, very safe. It can be taken every week during flu season. I take it when I fly, always. I take it when I'm going to be in public, in a group, like at a conference or a large group, or if I'm in my office and a child comes in sneezing and coughing and drooling. I'll go home and I'll take a dose just to protect myself.

So just recently, my husband was at a social event and people were sick. And he felt like he was coming down with something so he came home, he took Influenzinum. That night, he felt like he had kind of a fever. The next day, it abated. And after that, he was totally fine.

So I mean it simply engages your immune system in a way to recognize these viruses and then mount its own immune response in a healthy way.

[0:22:28] Ashley James: The way you said that made me think of cancer again. To get the immune system to recognize it and respond in a different way. I wonder.

[01:22:44] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. And we actually use Carcinosin. Ashley. There's two types of Carcinosin. One is made from breast tumors. Another is made from 58 different kinds of cancer tumors. And it basically engages the immune system to recognize self from non-self and discriminate. Because that's really the hallmark of cancer is it hasn't recognized self from non-self. And it's allowed this growth to get out of control.

And we see that on the emotional level as well. The Type C personality, which is the cancer personality, has trouble with boundaries. They're givers. They're doers. They're strivers. They're people who always are worried about what the other person thinks. And they'll compromise themselves for the other person. They don't do self-care very well. And that's the typical cancer personality. So part of the challenge is learning how to care for oneself and recognize self from non-self, basically.

[01:23:44] Ashley James: Yeah. Let's all start putting ourselves first. Not to be selfish. But to be –

[01:23:53] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Healthy.

[01:23:55] Ashley James: And to realize that – so my mom died when she was 55. And growing up, my mom was athletic, gorgeous. She was a model. And then she became a rep for women's clothing lines. She built an empire. She built this beautiful company that she had to constantly look her best. She was walking around in stilettos, you know, 10 hours, 12 hours a day kind of thing. She'd wake up the crack of dawn, make us all protein shakes, and put on her gym outfit, and take her dry cleaning with her. And she would head to the gym by 6:00 in the morning. And then after the gym – so she worked out six days a week. And then she'd be gone all day. Come home at 7:00 and she'll have, like, a salad and a chicken breast. And then put me down to bed.  And then she'd go to sleep. And it was like rinse and repeat her whole life. She took supplements. She exercised a lot. She ate really clean. She didn't take enough downtime, that's for sure. But she was beautiful, hardworking, didn't take the time to rest and relax a lot. Because she was A type personality, constantly put stress on herself, and she had a lot of anger and a lot, I guess, a lot of fear. A lot of fear of not being successful. And then she just got liver cancer and died within months. And she was so healthy.

It was like a practical joke on our family because my dad struggled with weight. He would gain and lose 100 pounds, 200 pounds even. When he died, we had to pay extra money because the casket needed to be bigger. And just the year before he was his goal weight. His whole life he struggled greatly with that. And he constantly worked at it. But he also was A type personality, hard worker, did not even know what self-care was. Self-care to him was, like, treating themselves to a steak dinner, basically. But both of my parents were loving and wonderful people. And my dad died, you know, six years later when he was like 62 years old.

So to watch my mom who was the epitome of health. My dad who was not the epitome of health end up outliving my mom. And my mom was the healthiest person we knew. And for her to go so quickly had me really look at self-care in a new light. That it's not selfish. That it is actually selfish not to do self-care. That my mom – because I'd asked her so many times to – like I said to her, “Stay home. Hang out with me.” And she kept saying, “I'm going to give you a better childhood than I had.” But at the end of the day, could have worked less. And again, I'm not blaming her. It's just a hindsight, right? Looking at it and going, if she had created a more balanced life, yeah, maybe she would have made less money, but she would have been happier and she'd still be alive, possibly.

[01:27:18 Dr. Cilla Whatcott: How old were you, Ashley?

[01:27:20] Ashley James: When she died? I was 22. So self-care is not selfish. It is selfish to not do self-care. Because our children need us here alive. And it's okay. My friend, Naomi, she takes off and goes to the women's spa once in a while. And treats herself to – it's a beautiful spa here in Seattle in Lynnwood, where it's an all women spa. And you basically hang out with a bunch of women and hot tubs and saunas. And it's like her family won't have her for a few hours. And they will have to fend for themselves. But she's doing her self-care.

And I say bye- bye to my son and my husband and I get in the sauna. And they have to fend for themselves for an hour or whatever. But it's like we have to – sometimes we have to disconnect from our family and take care of ourselves. But it's for our family that we do it. So I just know that some of us still have to get over that idea that self-care is selfish. Even buying a massage, like, “Oh, that $60.”  And taking $60 away from buying books for my son or something. Our little voice in our head says that money should be spent on our family. But if we're not doing the self- care that we need every day or every week and decreasing our stress, supporting our immune health, then we're not ensuring that will be here long term.

[01:28:58] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Right. You're very, very right. It took cancer for me to give myself permission to care for myself.

[01:29:04] Ashley James: Yeah. And that caring for yourself equals caring for your family. I love that you did the shotgun approach. But is there anything that you can share as you think back? Like, did you ever add something and then go, “Wow. It's really working. I'm glad I added this.” Is there any kind of stuff that you added along the way and you're really happy you did?

[01:29:31] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Probably the diet. Just supplemental, just tons of organic vegetables, you know, smoothies and vegetables. That's really your foundation, what you're putting in your body. I'd say that's huge. And my diet wasn't bad to begin with. So it was hard for me to accept that I was doing anything good. Because it was like this isn't very different than I've always eaten. But I saw people at Hope4Cancer who came from terrible diets, do that diet for three weeks, and have their tumors shrink to nothing before they got out. So I watched it.

Like your mother, my lifestyle wasn't that unhealthy. I was overworking. And I had a lot of trauma in my past that was still activated for me that I had to address.

[01:30:29] Ashley James: What did you do to address it? Because trauma is another really big – it's another really big – they see that there's a connection between unresolved trauma and disease. Dr. Hamer, who has unfortunately passed away, he created meta medicine. I started studying it in 2005. And I think it's fascinating that he could identify disease in the body and relate it back to a trauma that has been unresolved.

[01:31:00] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. So this does bring to mind an answer to your question, is there anything that really worked well for me. And what I used to address trauma was microcurrent. So microcurrent is a method that was introduced by chiropractors for muscular skeletal stuff initially. And then it was shown to have value with PTSD and different forms of trauma. So it's a very, very low level current that's run through the body. You don't feel anything at all.

[01:31:33] Ashley James: Is this frequency specific microcurrent?

[01:31:35] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah, yeah. That's it.

[01:31:36] Ashley James: Yeah. I've had an interview – fascinating. For some reason, I didn't think it would affect emotions.

[01:31:46] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Who did you interview? Who was the person you interviewed? Is it Carolyn?

[0 1:31:50] Ashley James: Carolyn McMakin? McMakin?

[01:31:52] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: That's it. Yeah. Yeah. And she still teaches

[01:31:55] Ashley James: Episode 332 and 333. It's a two parter. That interview was amazing. I asked my first question, which is tell me your story. So you know I love – when you're a new guest, I get you to tell your story. One hour later, I asked my second question.

[01:32:14] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. She's amazing.

[01:32:16] Ashley James: It was phenomenal. Her story is phenomenal. Oh my gosh, I never knew that frequency specific –

[01:32:22] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. I loved it. I loved it. And I did it twice a week for a while. It was huge for me. I knew I needed something that was hands on. I didn't want something that was based on talk. Because I'm a talker and I'm an analytical person and I've talked my trauma to death. I don't need to talk about it anymore.

[01:32:49] Ashley James: It's funny you should say that. It's like, you know intellectually – you can kind of intellectualize the trauma out then it's still stuck in the body.

[01:33:02] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Yeah. I needed something to get it out of my body. Since it had to be something that was touching me, I did EFT, I did Qigong, I did – what was it called? They did it at Hope4Cancer. It was recall healing. But it's based on talking and looking at different traumas at different ages and how in the ancestry it relates. So I did all of those things. But it was that microcurrent that I really liked. And she did craniosacral at the same time. So she'd hook me up to the microcurrent and do craniosacral. So there's no talking involved.

[01:33:45] Ashley James: Right. How did you know it was working on your traumas?

[01:33:49] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Because after some of the sessions I would just have this amazing feeling the next day. Just like this well-being feeling like when I was a kid that I had forgotten. So I liked it a lot.

[01:34:08] Ashley James: I mean, did you ever try testing it? Thinking back to your trauma and then realizing the emotions weren't there anymore? Or did you –

[01:34:15] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: No. Because the emotions aren't there. I can talk about any of the trauma very analytically that I do not sense any emotions being there anymore. I think it's only at a cellular level. So in that way, I didn't notice anything. But definitely this just subtle sense the next day of well-being. And I went after it. Like I said, Qigong, EFT, lots of different kinds of energetic therapies. But it didn't click. It didn't feel like, “Yeah. This is it. I got it.” It was until the microcurrent.

[01:34:57] Ashley James: Cool. Thank you for sharing that. I encourage you to also check into Timeline Therapy created by Ted James.

[01:35:06] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Timeline Therapy. Okay.

[01:35:08] Ashley James: Timeline Therapy. I'm a master practitioner and trainer of Timeline Therapy. I learned it in 2005 from Todd James, of have no relation. And he created it. But it is, I guess, inspired by neuro linguistic programming. It is incredibly effective at getting to the root cause of trauma and resolving it at the unconscious and conscious level. Although you might not need it now. But yeah, Timeline Therapy is phenomenal. I've had really great success with resolving chronic pain, anxiety, phobias, fears, anger, sadness, fear, hurt, guilt that is unresolved from the past it just keeps hanging on. It's great. It's great. So that's another thing. But like you said, you know, taking the shotgun approach, trying one thing, trying another, and finding your truth, finding what's going to resonate with you. And it's good to do this. Always looking at the labs. We have to look subjectively and objectively to make sure we're on the right path.

Don't put our head in the sand. It's so easy to because it's part of our culture. I feel like in the mainstream of Hollywood and just every day we're bombarded by this culture of putting our head in the sand and just going the easy route, going with the flow. Just go to the doctor, take the pills, do what they say, eat the food everyone else eats. Just go with the flow. And when we do that, we become a statistic. One in three people have pre-diabetes. One in three people have a cancer diagnosis in their lifetime. I think the number is worse for men. Or was it worse for women?

[01:37:02] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Women. Women.

[01:37:03] Ashley James: Women. Like one or two women are going to have – 50% of women are going to have a cancer diagnosis in their lifetime. Over 70% of the adult population of the United States is on at least one prescription medication. There's currently over 2 million children in the United States on –

[01:37:22] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Chronic meds.

[01:37:22] Ashley James: — antipsychotic medication. I mean, I just read that. So the statistics are getting worse and worse. And if we want to be a statistic, we must live like everyone else's. We'll go with the flow, right? But if we want to not be a statistic, we have to go upstream. We have to at least challenge the status quo to shake it up. And so you're going upstream. And at first, it's a bit exhausting. Because, like you said, we have that pressure from our family and our culture and this constant bombardment of mainstream media telling us we're wrong. And I love that you're putting together a group of people so we, at least, can start to realize we're not alone. And that there are other people out there. Like in our Learn True Health Facebook Group, like listeners of this group, and also the people who are following you and want to join your groups. That there are communities or pockets of people that want to swim upstream. And it becomes easier, especially when we start seeing results.

Now, before we wrap up today's interview, this has been on my mind and I'm sort of racking my brain for which guests told on me this. So hopefully, you can clarify. I heard that the immune system of an infant and even a child up until between age six and seven cannot or should not produce T cells or should not – like there's something about an immune system of a young child before the age of six that isn't designed to produce this kind of immunity that a vaccine forces it to produce. Have you heard of this?

[01:39:08] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Right. Yeah. And I think it's only the first couple years that they're not fully mature. A child's immune system isn't fully mature until the age of 12, I believe. But in those first few years, they're not producing antibodies in the same way that they do once they're mature. And I can't tell you the physiological theory behind that. But you're correct that their immune systems can't produce.

[01:39:34] Ashley James: And so they're being forced to. The body is being forced to produce it. And that we're seeing a giant spike in autoimmune as a result of, basically, playing God and messing with the immune system. We talked about this a little bit in our other interviews about how having an autoimmune disease is something that we need to look at as well when healing the body. Because the immune system gone awry. So cancer, catching a cold like a virus, an autoimmune condition. There's acute and chronic but it all has to do with coming back to the immune system. So in your three part documentary movie series, you go through this. You talk about how to help the immune system come back into balance. Do you have any specific guests talk about autoimmune issues?

[01:40:22] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: I can't recall if there's a specific interview that addresses this. But I would say very simply that indiscriminate inflammation is what causes autoimmunity. So when you pump an immune system full of adjuvants, such as aluminum which are designed to create inflammation and, thus, antibodies. You're promoting indiscriminate inflammation in the body. So of course you're going to see autoimmunity. It's logical.

[01:40:56] Ashley James: Yeah. Well, I urge listeners to go back and check out our other and views because they are enlightening and fascinating and have largely influenced what I do with my health and my family.

So I thank you because our family has, obviously, we're doing the shotgun approach too. We're eating healthy. We're detoxing. We're doing all of it. But we added homeoprophylaxis and Influenzinum. And you'd be so proud. The other day my husband had this dry cough that you couldn't shake. It was the weirdest thing. And throw stuff at him. And I made him some throat coat tea. I took some fresh thyme. I made him a tea and all this other stuff. And then he went by himself to the medicine cabinet and got himself homeopathic remedies. And figured out by himself which remedy. And I think it was like nux vomica, which like surprised me, but that was the one that worked for him. But he figured out. He researched online. He picked three different ones. He tested it himself. I didn't need to do any of it for him. I was proud. And I also kind of was kicking myself because I didn't think about homeopathy. Homeopathy for him is in the forefront of his mind because we've seen it work so well with our son and also for me. And I've shared in the past Episodes my amazing, amazing results with homeopathy and our son's. And so now it's actually the forefront of my husband's mind. That's one of the first things he thinks about when he has a symptom is to go to homeopathy. So I thank you for that influence.

[01:42:38] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: I love it. That's really great bliss. Thank you so much.

[01:42:41] Ashley James: I want to make sure listeners know, go to Episode 137, 155, 228, and 305 to listen to other interviews.

Cilla, thank you so much for coming on the show. It has been such a pleasure to have you back. And I'm really looking forward to watching the rest of your documentary. I've seen the first one. The first Episode, Quest For Real Immunity. I'm really excited for Passage For Real Immunity and of course, Choosing Real Immunity because that's where the entire thing takes a totally different direction. I'm sure it's going to be fascinating. I'm really excited. So I definitely urge listeners to sign up to watch it for free. Is there anything that you'd like to say to wrap up today's interview?

[01:43:27] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Well, my sincere thanks for having me, of course. But I think in closing, I would just say that the consciousness of this entire world is raising. And it's calling people to take responsibility. And with choice comes responsibility. You can't have it both ways. You can't look towards someone to tell you what to do. But ask for your free agency at the same time. So I would just say learn, listen. You know you've learned enough when there's not fear. Get past the fear. Fear is a very low vibration. And have trust in your intuition. But like you're saying, Ashley, use your head and your heart. Look at the facts plus look at your intuition. Put the two together and really exercise your free agency and then take responsibility.

[01:44:24] Ashley James: You remind me of the quote from Dune, “I must not fear. Fear is the mind killer. “Fear is the mind killer, I was like, “Oh, yeah.” So get past the fear. And I like that, when you've studied enough and you know enough and you have sort of armed yourself with enough information, the fear will be running you.

[01:44:47] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: It's gone.

[01:44:47] Ashley James: Yeah.Right. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Cilla. Please come back on the show anytime you want to share or teach. We'd be lucky to have you.

[01:44:58] Dr. Cilla Whatcott: Thank you, Ashley. Thanks so much.

[01:45:01] Outro: Hello, true health seeker. Have you ever thought about becoming a health coach? Do you love learning about nutrition? And how we can shift our lifestyle and our diet so that we can gain optimal health and happiness and longevity? Do you love helping your friends and family to solve their health problems and to figure out what they can do to eat healthier? Are you interested in becoming someone who can grow their own business, support people in their success? Do you love helping people?

You might be the perfect candidate to become a health coach. I highly recommend checking out the Institute for Integrative Nutrition. I just spent the last year in their health coaching certification program. And it really blew me away. It was so amazing. I learned over 100 dietary theories. I learned all about nutrition. But from a standpoint of how we can help people to shift their lives and shift their lifestyle to gain true holistic health.

I definitely recommend that you check them out. You can Google Institute for integrative Nutrition or IIN and give them a call. Or you can go to learnttruehealth.com/coach and you can receive a free module of their training. So check it out and see if it's something that you'd be interested in. Be sure to mention my name, Ashley James, and the Learn True Health

Podcast because I made a deal with them that they will give you the best price possible. I highly recommend checking it out. It really changed my life to be in their program. And I'm such a big advocate that I wanted to spread this information.

We need more health coaches. In fact, health coaching is the largest growing career right now in the health field. So many health coaches are getting in and helping people because you can work in chiropractic offices, doctors offices. You can work in hospitals. You can work online through Skype and help people around the world. You can become an author. You can go into the school system and help your local schools shift their programs to help children to be healthier. You can go into senior centers and help them to shift their diet and lifestyle to best support them in their success in their health goals.

There's so many different available options for you when you become a certified health coach. So check out IIN. Check out the Institute for Integrative Nutrition. Mention my name. Get the best deal. Give them a call and they'll give you lots of free information and help you to see if this is the right move for you. Classes are starting soon.  The next round of classes are starting at the end of the month. So you're going to want to call them now and check it out. And if you know anyone in your life who would be an amazing coach, please tell them about it. Being a health coach is so rewarding and you get to help so many people.

Are you looking to get the best supplements at the lowest price? For high quality supplements and to talk to someone about what supplements are best for you, go to takeyoursupplements.com and one of our fantastic true health coaches will help you pick out the right supplements for you that are the highest quality and the best price. That's takeyoursupplements.com. Takeyoursupplements.com. That's takeyoursupplements.com. Be sure to ask about free shipping and our awesome referral program.

Get Connected With Dr. Cilla Whatcott! 

Real Immunity Organization

World Wide Choice

Family Homeopathy Care


Learn True Health – vaccines

Book by Dr. Cilla Whatcott

There Is a Choice – Homeoprophylaxis

Recommended Readings by Dr. Cilla Whatcott

Dissolving Illusions – Suzanne Humphries (Vaccines)

Miller’s Review of Critical Vaccine Studies – Neil Miller (Vaccines)

Impossible Cure –  Amy Lansky (Homeopathy)

The Complete  Homeopathy Handbook – Miranda Castro (Homeopathy)

Check out other interviews of Dr. Cilla Whatcott!

Episode 137: Homeoprophylaxis

Episode 155: Developing Real Immunity

Episode 228: Homeopathy

Episode 305: How To Naturally Avoid The Flu

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Ashley James

Health Coach, Podcast Creator, Homeschooling Mom, Passionate About God & Healing

Ashley James is a Holistic Health Coach, Podcaster, Rapid Anxiety Cessation Expert, and avid Whole Food Plant-Based Home Chef. Since 2005 Ashley has worked with clients to transform their lives as a Master Practitioner and Trainer of Neuro-linguistic Programming.

Her health struggles led her to study under the world’s top holistic doctors, where she reversed her type 2 diabetes, PCOS, infertility, chronic infections, and debilitating adrenal fatigue.

In 2016, Ashley launched her podcast Learn True Health with Ashley James to spread the TRUTH about health and healing. You no longer need to suffer; your body CAN and WILL heal itself when we give it what it needs and stop what is harming it!

The Learn True Health Podcast has been celebrated as one of the top holistic health shows today because of Ashley’s passion for extracting the right information from leading experts and doctors of holistic health and Naturopathic medicine


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